v0.8.9 (Bugfixes + translations) released to Google Play!

Useful links
Source code of the game - Contribution guide - ATCS Editor - Translate the game on Weblate - Example walkthrough - Andor's Trail Directory - Join the Discord
Get the game (v0.8.9) from Google, F-Droid, our server, or itch.io

LONG DUE FEEDBACK

A place for general discussion about the content and gameplay of Andor's Trail.
NewbNewb
Posts: 49
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:17 pm
android_version: 8.0

LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by NewbNewb »

So, I’ve been playing this game, probably since the beginning. Back when no sustenance or Dulian Road and farther. And every time a good new update arrives, I play the game with new save, to better experience the game as intended.
I wont really tackle more towards the good parts of the game much, since its already given that I play the game every year maybe. there are a lot of interesting and exciting part that the game have compared to when I first played.
With probably 10+ saves, here are my long due feedback on the present problems I see on the game and its updates.

ITEMS:

WEAPONS:

There are a large amount of trash equipment that makes the game less entertaining and fun. And I know the topic has been tackled millions of times already, but here are my takes. Having bad equipment at early parts of the game streamline and limits the players choices. You can’t really use any other type of weapon in the early game than sword and shield. No choice for 2 handed, or blunt weapon, or axe or polearms or anything really. For a game having freedom to choose the build and style through the playthrough, bad equipment turns it to an illusion of choice.
Also bad equipment in hard dungeons or place makes the whole trek through not worth it, or be completed when you are already too strong. Going through Charwood mine isn’t worth it for a bad dagger, at least at the expected lvl.

New type of weapons doesn’t have a dedicated good weapon. Like Flagstone pride for longsword, GoSH for 2 hand axe, GcoR or Xulvir for Great sword. But for mace, 1 hand axe, hammer and pole arms are introduced as different type of weapon without anything to promote them. Unlike other games where new character or new class are OP to help introduce or encourage players to use them, in AT there are none.

Let’s be honest here, lower AT cost weapon are better than high one, even with the dmg modifier. Anything with less than 2 AT per turn aren’t really viable or good. You won’t choose Annihilator over GcoR, even with high dmg modifier. Big reason for this is the lower AT chance, the problem with 1 AT is the lower chance of making impact. It’s better that high AT cost with high AT chance than high dmg modifier.
Ideas:
Each type of equipment should have at least 1 equipment dedicated to that type and style. Be also accessible in early lvl (less than 20 maybe) to promote the weapon type and have an experience for players with the type.
High AT cost weapon should have better AC to remedied (lower the dmg modifier if needed). It is still not worth it to use high AT cost weapon over low cost, even with higher damage. Another problem with this topic is the number of enemies and enemy status that lower AC, than lower the dmg, along with ones that lower max AP.

RINGS:
Rings in the game offers one of the best stat increases in the game. But they are very limited and accessible at very early lvls, you can finish Flagstone prison at lvl 10 with 2 Villains ring. After purchase of rings, there aren’t really mush better ones( unless you grind for RoLS). There are new rings at later parts but aren’t better just different.
Ideas:
Implement a lvl requirement for buying the rings. A way to enchant? Enhance just the rings. Add a stat for the rings, similar to weapon proficiency in charwood, but specific stat increase like AC, BC, or dmg of the rings.

SHIELDS:
Shield in the game are really bad. Way back when you can pair shield with anything they are important as they are an additional equipment. But currently, going shield and weapon is only good for low lvl, at later parts, transitioning to dual wield or 2 handed is better, or just use pairing weapons.
Ideas:
Better shield at later game. Also, variety of shield and be more similar to Armor, with different stats distribution. Shield that focusses on BC, one type that focus on dmg resist, another that’s more offensive (not pairing weapons)
There aren’t also a good variety of shield, like tower shield, heavy and light or combat.

EQUIPMENT PENALTY:
PLEASE TAKE IT EASY WITH THE PENALTY!
Penalty for equipment really hinders the use of the equipment and the choices for certain missions and playthrough. Some penalty (like Shadowstalker or Annihilator) can be remedied in exchange for the equipment stats. But some are too much to even consider (like Blackwater curse) making them absolutely unusable. Specially with some really cool equipment that are very cool and very interesting.
A good comparison to this is Pokemon, not all are the best to use in each playthrough, but all are possible to be use. In AT, most equipment are unusable, its specially more disappointing with rarer or unique items.
Ideas:
Make them at least usable or with an equal power exchange to considered the option be experienced. Also axes shouldn’t have that much of AT cost, since they are lighter than people might think, there downside is they’re all out attack that reduce defense.

NEW CONTENT DISTRIBUTION:
There are a lot of empty content in playthroughs, like in lvl 6-10. There are a lot of new content that aren’t already needed. The new mushroom cave is at a low lvl that it has to contest with other that already exist, making them not that enjoyable. New content should probably be focused more towards the later stages(lvl 35+) since there are already too much content in lower stages.

SKILLS:
Skills in this game are really outdated. There’s not much variety for the new version of the game and are only for the old game from years ago. Skills that helps with resistance to status seems very situational and are unusable for the overall game. They are also not worth it with really low numbers. Other situational skills also suffer the same problem.
Skill points frequency are also scarce, especially with dedicating skill points too certain skill, like increase fortitude, 2 Combat speed or 2 dual weapons.
Ideas:
More skills from mission, quest or NPC to be gained and traded be more present in later parts of the game.

POWER INCREASE:
At later stages of the game, gaining stat increase is very hard with mostly just from lvl up. Currently there is only 2 ways of increasing power, Equipment and lvl up. With equipment it becomes stagnated at certain points and with lvl its very slow increase. With more stuff in the game, a new way to improve and increase power should be added.
Idea:
Like a bounty board or mercenary mission where it requires the player to kill a specific monster or a collection of specific monster. Upon completing, you can add stats like a normal lvl up (or different). It should also have different tiers and lvl requirements (20, 30, 40, 50) to prevent grinding.
Stats like AC or BC, Crit skill, Crit multiplier, Dmg resist, or even permanent status effect.
This idea might spice up the playthrough and builds for the players.
User avatar
Antison
Posts: 5254
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2011 11:33 pm
android_version: 14 - Android 14
Location: A home without a beagle is just a house

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by Antison »

As far as your feedback on the weapons and the skills and the rings, I completely agree with you. In fact, we've been having a lot of internal conversations in the last 2 weeks about all of these.
As far as the equipment penalties are concerns, there's not going to be any real big change here. You mentioned the blackwater penalty. But with those that penalty does not stack. So you only get the penalty once. And who cares if you get a minus on your critical hit skill when those weapons do not provide a critical skill.

As far as the content distribution is concerned, it sounds to me like you have not gone to Sullengard or the haunted forest.
The former is designed for players in the mid 50s. While the haunted forest is designed for players in the mid-40s.

As far as giving skills as a reward for request, you'll be happy to see in a future release there will be something like this.
"A home without a beagle is just a house"
User avatar
rijackson741
Posts: 4451
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 2:04 am
android_version: 10 - Android 10
Location: Somewhere in Dhayavar
Contact:

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by rijackson741 »

Weapons with lower attack cost are not always better. Given the same AC, of course with more attacks you get a higher chance for one hit, but you get a rather low chance for four hits. If the high attack cost weapon does a lot more damage you may get more damage per round with that, and what you are really after is more AD per round. This is especially true if the monster has high DR. I'm sick of posting the basic math for this, so I'm not doing it again. However, I agree that there is a problem early game where the only good weapons are daggers and one-handed swords. We could address that.

I would also not use any weapon with too high an attack cost, but my threshold would not be two attacks, it would be one with a chance to flee afterwards.

Rings, I agree. All the good rings were added very early, when the game was very limited (before any of the current dev team even got involved). Now it's difficult to add more that are better without making them OP. Perhaps we should move the best ones, and replace them early game with lesser versions? Another thought I has was to make the effect of JoF and MT an actor condition that does not stack. Then we could add rings elsewhere that give you the same effect (or even armor, for that matter), giving the player many more options when choosing a necklace.

Skills do come up. But it seems nobody can think of more good ones, so it has stagnated. Please suggest some.

Power. This is easy. Harder monsters worth more XP. Try Sullengard.

Content distribution. Well, we can't win on this one. We added more early content because of complaints that starting out was too hard. Then players complained about intermediate levels being too hard, so we added more content. Now you are saying that there's too much intermediate level content. Others have asked for more high level content, which we just added. Like I said, we can't ever win on this one.
Level:71, XP:6493739, PV:608, FQ:84
HP:210, AC:212, AD:58-77, AP:4, ECC:16%, CM:1.5, BC:188, DR:3
Gold: 237559 | RoLS:1, RoL:1, GoW:1, VSH:1, RoFLS:1, WoB:1
HH:1, WA:1, CS:2, Cl:1, IF:4, Ev:3, Re:2, WP:DA:1, WP:1S:1, WP:B:1, AP:L:1, FS:DW:2, S:DW:1
NewbNewb
Posts: 49
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:17 pm
android_version: 8.0

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by NewbNewb »

I'm honestly just care more towards viable weapon diversity, to have different build and experience.
The rings are to easily accessible (maybe I just miss the time when I didnt directly buy VIllains ring).
And skills, since most of them are from the start of the game.

everything else is just a nitpick. Content is hard to create and takes time. Weapon AC can be remedied at later game.
u2girl1966
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2022 2:14 am
android_version: 10 - Android 10
Location: Chicago

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by u2girl1966 »

I think this might have been addressed either here or on the Discord channel, but the ability to add a new skill every 3rd level, instead of 4 might be nice. But it might be to hard to change, since I'd imagine that would change the game engine to a certain extent.
"Shout into the darkness, squeeze out sparks of light" - U2
Lam al Adie
Posts: 202
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2021 4:14 pm
android_version: 11 - Android 11
Location: gargoylecave

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by Lam al Adie »

New skills? How about a combination of taunt, concussion or fracture?
So if you deflect a blow, you not only taunt them, but additionally manage to redirect the blow on the attacker themselves.
Given the levels needed for those advanced skills, that's only for very high level characters.

Oh, and a taunt lvl 2 would be nice:
Requires taunt, 4 evasion, 6 dodge
Gives: 20% for 2 rounds of -2AP on the attacker, (stackable?)
Last edited by Antison on Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Combined posts. Please refrain from posting back to back
Lam 'al Adie (pd)
Lvl:68 XP: 5728519 AP: 12/3 HP: 204 AC: 228 AD: 43-55 BC: 164 DR: 7
Skills: WA: 1 Do: 4 CS: 2 IF: 4 Ev: 2 Reg: 1 WP:1S: 1 AP:S: 1 FS:WS: 2 S:WS: 1
ROLS: 1 GoLF: 1
SeraphTheOne
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2023 3:58 am
android_version: 10 - Android 10

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by SeraphTheOne »

There are way too many two-handed weapon drops. I can't use any of them. The only viable weapons for me has been Yatagan and the DarkHeart broadsword. There isn't really anything else for a One-handed fighter.
Level: 75, XP: 8897768, Gold: 196187
HP: 190, AC: 302, AD: 45-84, AP: 4, ECC: 17, CM: 2, BC: 310, DR: 3
ElyR: 1, RoLS: 2, RoL: 1, All Extraordinary Items.
Completed Quests: All Posible, Places Visited: All Possible, Monster Kills: 67506
User avatar
rijackson741
Posts: 4451
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 2:04 am
android_version: 10 - Android 10
Location: Somewhere in Dhayavar
Contact:

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by rijackson741 »

u2girl1966 wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 1:41 pm I think this might have been addressed either here or on the Discord channel, but the ability to add a new skill every 3rd level, instead of 4 might be nice. But it might be to hard to change, since I'd imagine that would change the game engine to a certain extent.
It wouldn't be that hard to change, but we are not going to. We have had requests for every level, every two levels, every three levels. Never a request for every five levels though ;)
Level:71, XP:6493739, PV:608, FQ:84
HP:210, AC:212, AD:58-77, AP:4, ECC:16%, CM:1.5, BC:188, DR:3
Gold: 237559 | RoLS:1, RoL:1, GoW:1, VSH:1, RoFLS:1, WoB:1
HH:1, WA:1, CS:2, Cl:1, IF:4, Ev:3, Re:2, WP:DA:1, WP:1S:1, WP:B:1, AP:L:1, FS:DW:2, S:DW:1
NewbNewb
Posts: 49
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:17 pm
android_version: 8.0

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by NewbNewb »

rijackson741 wrote: Sun Mar 26, 2023 8:08 pm Skills do come up. But it seems nobody can think of more good ones, so it has stagnated. Please suggest some.
Here are some of my suggestions for new skill, just some variety skills that might spice and change some playthrough. Or just to add more options to the game, probably not too strong but will create new build path.

BLOODIED RAGE (lvl 20 requirement, 50 base HP)
Gain increase 20 AC and 3 Dmg at 15% HP

WELL RESTED (lvl 20 requirement, 50 base HP)
Gain 10 AC and 1 Dmg resist at more than 85% HP(or FULL HP)

SURPRISE ATTACK (lvl 15 requirement, 30 crit skill)
Increase 15% crit chance against enemy with full HP

LAST CHANCE (lvl 30 requirement)
When taking lethal Dmg, 10% chance to stay at 1 HP

ART OF COMBAT (lvl 40 requirement)
Gain 1 AC for every 1 Dmg from equipment
or Gain 3 BC for every 1 Dmg resist from equipment

POTION MASTER (lvl 30 requirement)
Gain extra 10% healing from healing items (exclude sustenance, regeneration)
User avatar
Antison
Posts: 5254
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2011 11:33 pm
android_version: 14 - Android 14
Location: A home without a beagle is just a house

Re: LONG DUE FEEDBACK

Post by Antison »

SeraphTheOne wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 8:57 pm There are way too many two-handed weapon drops. I can't use any of them. The only viable weapons for me has been Yatagan and the DarkHeart broadsword. There isn't really anything else for a One-handed fighter.
There's flagstone's Pride and the Lifetaker. There is the Rapier of Lifesteal to name a few more
"A home without a beagle is just a house"
Post Reply