Andor's Trail

Hello peoples,

This is my first post/topic since playing Andors Trail for about a month now. I have been forum lurking for some time though and am highly impressed with both the game, and the forum. So first and foremost, hats off to the developers and players alike !
Now to the issue - what is the critical chance changes from the current version to the mysteriously unknown, highly anticipated, future version? I know there will be a name change, and a drastic reduction in CC. Yet does anyone know the specifics? I currently have a CC build character, and am wondering how much weaker I will be when the new release comes out. If it is that much of a reduction, I would just as soon know now, so I can build my character in another direction.
I know the "refund skill" idea has been posted before, applauded by some and critizied by others, but I feel that the CC refund is a completely different subject on its own. Increased fortitude could not be refunded to the old players, due to it being earned retroactivly. Yet CC is not just a universal skill, like say IF, QL, MF or any of the resistance skills. That being said, Critical Chance skill isn't just a skill, it is a character build all on its own. A defensive build does not go with CC, and a balanced character rarely will, and the hard hitter isn't even going to waste his time. Yet both the defensive, and balanced, or even the hard hitting builds, can use all other skills to their advantage, based on personal desire and build centered skills. I realize this is a rougelike game, and I for one am thrilled to find one. That is the reason I will not do any side related quest untill the next release is out. That being said, I based my CC build on the knowledge of the skills and information I had at hand, so why should all the CC builds be drasticly diminished without a proper say so?

I hope this didn't seem like a rant, I absolutly am addicted to andors trail and support whichever decisions the developers go with. I am just simply seeking information on the progress of the CC build. Thanks and God Bless all

Welcome to the forum!



the critical hits in 6.10 are linear - a very straightforward percentage. My CC is 50% = Half my hits are Critical, Period.
the critical hits in 6.11 will be non-linear, Percentages will be dropped / replaced with a variable.

the new formula is posted somewhere, and a graph too...
give me a sec an i can find a link.
(might also be some stuff in the Issue Tracker on the code page)

this change will effectively lower the amount of critical hits the player gets,
in reaction to that - Oskar wants to implement occasionally adding Actor Conditions to a Critical hit.
(as opposed to returning points to players who feel short-changed)

Oskar suggested "Bleeding Wounds" & i liked the idea...
i added that bludgeoning weapons should probably cause something like "Fatigue" instead.
(assuming a blade would cause Bleeding Wounds)

i feel that less frequent criticals will make the game stronger,
and the added Actor Conditions will also add a feeling of depth. (in my opinion)

hope this makes sense?



i will be back to edit in some links to the new critical chart & non-linear formula!

take care all & happy hunting!



---edit---

oskarwiksten wrote:The formula we'll be using can be found in this document:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc ... DJWSUlIY2c

The change basically transfers the current value of "critical chance" (CC) from v0.6.10 into something with equal value called "critical skill" (CS) in v0.6.11. The effective critical chance (ECC) will then be calculated as a scaled version of the square root of the CS value, which gives the graph posted above.

The formula is ECC=-5 + 2 * sqrt(5*CS)

Having CC higher than 100% provided no real benefit in v0.6.10, but with the system introduced in v0.6.11, having higher values will still give some benefit. Reaching very high values of ECC is, however, very hard.

Sarumar wrote:Can you please double (at least) every current monsters crit hit chance.

Good point Sarumar. We'll go through the monsters before release and increase the critical skill on some of them, to keep the intention of some monsters being really good at critical hits. Not all of them though, since that would be unfair to the players

and...

sdevaney wrote:

der_Hosenwyrm wrote:Can anyone explain how the new critical hit system will work? (Or at least provide a very basic explanation as to how it will affect players for whom critical hits are an important aspect of their build...)

I suppose the easiest way to explain it for now is to show it in a graph, a more detailed explanation will be coming:

That explains a lot, thanks for the explanation and the graph. Looks like my CC build is gona be a weakling in the new release. Time for a new build lol.

AlphaOmega wrote:That explains a lot, thanks for the explanation and the graph. Looks like my CC build is gona be a weakling in the new release. Time for a new build lol.

I retired my LVL 100 because I focused on CC mostly. I just started another build and have reached lvl 20, so far so good without using crits.

Happy hunting!

Hi AlphaOmega,

thanks for your post. I can totally understand your concern in having invested time in a specific build, and whether that particular build will be as powerful or not after the next update. The thing we are trying to address with these changes is the fact that you could build a character that did most of the attacks as critical hits, which was never intended, and IMO is very unrealistic. The way we want to balance this change is so that a player with these characteristics will still be powerful, but just not by doing criticals hits all the time. We'll try to balance it in such a way that you can keep your build, and still be satisfied with it. Also, keep in mind that the combat changes also apply to the attacks of all monsters, which will make some monsters easier hurt less than before.

What we discussed on the last meeting, that sdevaney brought up, and which I think is an excellent idea - is the ability to do other effect types on a percentage of the critical hits. For example, "bleeding wound" or "stun" or something like that. An effect like that would still make the criticals powerful, but would keep the intention of them being strikes that land on a particularly bad (or good) spot on the monster's body or armour.

If you have ideas on what effect types we should use for criticals, please feel free to suggest them.

Of course, now that you have started another build, you might find out another distribution of stats that you find works good. That's the beauty of RPG:s, that you can play with several different strategies

AlphaOmega wrote:That explains a lot, thanks for the explanation and the graph. Looks like my CC build is gona be a weakling in the new release. Time for a new build lol.

Dont give up yet It is easy to get nice 30-40% chance for crit hit in next version of AT.. just couple skill points and some charefully chosen gears

i agree, i'm actually MORE interested in Criticals now!

You just like the challenge

true, true...
(am i that transparent? - )

but really, mage is my favored class...
and causing status effects has ALWAYS pleased me
(on at least on some level)

so, the lower criticals seem more realistic
and, the added status effects satisfy my need to poison, numb, and all around just "bother" the mobs

this update is going to exponentially increase this games appeal, in my opinion.
a scenario in my head...

You hit a mob with a critical - It starts bleeding (wounds) - You hit it again - It dies & SPLAT!!! (blood splatter)
AWESOME!!!

But most of the effects do not actually do anything during the battle in which you get them. The main effect is during the next 5 or 10 rounds, when the monster will be dead. So how do you give a monster an effect? If you give him a bleeding wound, what happens? Does he lose one extra HP from blood loss? Big deal! It certainly does not make up for a one hundred HP loss from a critical hit that didn't happen.
I am OK with my ECC being half of my current CC, I just don't see the point in wasting programing time on adding effects that will not do anything to the (already dead) monsters. Chaotic grip and fatigue are the two effects that take effect immediately, so they might be useful, reducing the monster's ability to harm you or increasing your ability to harm it. Except for those two, and whatever "stun" might be, I would say forget about causing monsters effects in place of our critical hits. I don't know what stun is, but it sounds like it should start during the battle that causes it, so it would also be useful.