I love this game... but, there is far too much dependency on grinding

[rijackson741]

Why not speed up the respawn or have a single map with an endless mob of random monsters, already defeated bosses, mini-bosses etc.?

Because that's not AT.

[Grawmpy]

1/10,000 is 10% in 1000

You need to check your math mate...

1/10,000 is .01%, or .0001, not 10%.
10% would be 1 out of 10, or 10 out of 100, or 100 out of 1000, or 1000 out of 10,000. The fraction is 1/10,000 not 1/10. Use a calculator and divide 1 by 10 and you get .01 or 10%

Think of it this way, if you have a die with 10,000 sides (like a twenty-sided die in D&D), only one of those sides would give you a legendary item. Each Magic Finder skill adds another half a side from the 10,000 sides that will give you the extraordinary item, but only if you land on the half that is marked as giving it, not the whole side. On the twenty-sided die, every time you roll the die there is a 5% chance that you will hit 20, but a 95% chance of landing on something else. With zero Magic Finder skills you have a .01% chance of getting a legendary item and a 99.99% chance of not getting it. Every Magic Finder skill adds .005% to your odds. This means that every second Magic Finder skills adds one more side or .01% to the possibility of getting it. So, 2 Magic Finder skills is .02%, or 2 sides of the 10,000 side die, or 2/10,000; 3 is .025% or 2 1/2 sides of the 10,000 side die, or 2.5/10,000; 4 is .03% or 3 sides of the 10,000 side die, or 3/10,000;etc, and so on.

Every time you kill a monster that drops a extraordinary item you have the same odds, or possibility of it giving you the extraordinary item. The chances that it will give you that extraordinary item gradually goes up the more monsters you kill, but the odds are the same that it will happen for each kill you make. You could literally kill 10,000 monsters (if you're very unlucky) without any Magic Finder skills and not get one legendary item because the odds are the same for each kill, .01%. Statistically though, you would get the item way before you reached 10,000 kills, but it's still very high, like 6,700 kills. Even if you increase the magic finder up to 255, this still only gives you a 1.275% possibility of getting a legendary item on each kill, and a 98.725% of not.

It depends more on pure dumb luck and tenacity than any kind of skill.

[draze]

It depends more on pure dumb luck and tenacity than any kind of skill.

What a sad reality.

Even if you increase the magic finder up to 255, this still only gives you a 1.275% possibility of getting a legendary item on each kill, and a 98.725% of not.

Thank you for the clarification. 98.725% of not?! I understand now why grinding for legendary items like "Elytharan Redeemer" is still difficult for us (players) even though we have a given level of IF.

[rijackson741]

10% would be 1 out of 10, or 10 out of 100, or 100 out of 1000, or 1000 out of 10,000. The fraction is 1/10,000 not 1/10.

Correct so far.

Use a calculator and divide 1 by 10 and you get .01 or 10%

Get a new calculator. Divide 1 by 10 and you get 0.1, not 0.01. That is indeed 10%. So 10% in 1000 = 0.1 x 1/1000 = 1/10,000

Think of it this way, if you have a die with 10,000 sides (like a twenty-sided die in D&D), only one of those sides would give you a legendary item.

Or you can just plug the numbers in to the spreadsheet I posted here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6613

[Grawmpy]

rijackson741, you are correct in saying that .10 is equal to 10%, it was a typing error on my part. I was wrong.

Also, I mistakenly put extraordinary rather than legendary, thinking that the extraordinary was the rarer of the two. I was wrong.

Even so, in reference to the excel spreadsheet that you list, on the tab labeled "Prob of finding Ext, Leg items" I quote:

Drop rate for extraordinary items: 0.1%
Drop rate for legendary items: 0.01%

The way this is listed, it tells me that the calculation to move the decimal point when converting it to a percentage has already been completed when you placed the % symbol after the numbers in question. If this is not correct then this needs to be changed to refer to the correct notation. When I look at the spreadsheet (looking at it with what my simple brain learned about percentages and fractions back in middle school math, which stayed the same through high school and college) the extraordinary drop rate number was originally .001 and the legendary .0001 before the conversion to a percentage, neither of which are equal to 10% (it seems as if you are claiming in your post that both are equal to 10%) or .10. It's 1/10th of 1% and 1/100 of 1% respectively. No matter how I look at it I don't get your reasoning. Personally I think you are confusing 0.1% as 0.1 (10%), when in actuality it is one-tenth of one percent for extraordinary items and one one-hundredth of one percent for legendary items, neither of which equal one percent let alone ten percent.

I don't want to get into a debate here, so I won't respond to any more comments on this particular issue after this post, giving you the last word if you like, but I will say that I respectfully disagree with your conclusion that either .001% or .01% are in any way, shape, or form, equal to 10%. Say what you will, you aren't going to convince me otherwise.

[Grawmpy]

It depends more on pure dumb luck and tenacity than any kind of skill.

What a sad reality.

Even if you increase the magic finder up to 255, this still only gives you a 1.275% possibility of getting a legendary item on each kill, and a 98.725% of not.

Thank you for the clarification. 98.725% of not?! I understand now why grinding for legendary items like "Elytharan Redeemer" is still difficult for us (players) even though we have a given level of IF.

Should say legendary instead of extraordinary...
Sorry typing error. Should say "98.725% possibility of not receiving one."

[draze]

It depends more on pure dumb luck and tenacity than any kind of skill.

What a sad reality.

Even if you increase the magic finder up to 255, this still only gives you a 1.275% possibility of getting a legendary item on each kill, and a 98.725% of not.

Thank you for the clarification. 98.725% of not?! I understand now why grinding for legendary items like "Elytharan Redeemer" is still difficult for us (players) even though we have a given level of IF.

Should say legendary instead of extraordinary...
Sorry typing error. Should say "98.725% possibility of not receiving one."

I see. My brain just suddenly interpret the said error. Ergo, no worries because I still understand your point Grawmpy.

[rijackson741]

@Grampy: I was just responding to something you said in your original post: "Literally only 1% of every 1,000 kills drops these items". That should be "Literally only 10% of every 1,000 kills drops these items". Since then it seems to have morphed into something else.

[Grawmpy]

it's all good, no worries