Rare spawns and unbalanced skills

[Oet]

New day, new ideas...
I wanna talk about two things. Rare monsters and unbalanced skills.

Rare monsters
There is Legendary items, Extraordinary and rares. Why not monsters?
Let's say that we redo 1 spawn of "Wyrm apprentice"
That specific spawn has a 0,01% chance of spawning an "Undead Wyrm Master" instead of a Wyrm apprentice. The Undead Wyrm Master has significantly increased stats but will have a 100% drop chance of a Legendary item.




Unbalanced skills
Correct me if I'm wrong here, but aren't the skills a bit unbalanced? I am thinking about Weapon Accuracy, Hard Hit and Dodge.
Weapon Accuracy gives you 12% AC for each level.
Hard Hit hives you 2 AD each level.
Dodge gives you 9% BC each level.

Here's my point. If you want as much stats as possible, you will not choose Hard hit.
You get a skill point each 4 levels.
In 4 levels, by leveling up, you can get either 20% AC, 4 AD or 12% BC.

Weapon Accuracy will give you 60% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.
Hard Hit will give you 50% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.
Dodge will give you 75% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.

So, by other words, by never picking BC and instead leveling Dodge Skill, would max out the character faster?
(for the sake of making this as easy as possible, just imagine you have maxed out the other skills)

[sorrow]

For unbalanced skills like those u mention were just updated to were they are now. Plus take Dodge that give you BC once you get the amount you need for bark skin from Dodge you still wont beable to get bark skin because skills don't raise your base stats

[fiernaq]

Standard disclaimer about knowing that legendary items aren't needed to beat the game applies.

As much as I hate the grind I think there's a far simpler way of resolving this issue: Turn drop rate into a dependent probability formula. In other words, instead of each kill having no affect on the drop rate of your next kill make each kill slightly increase your odds. Of course, you don't want this increase in drop chance to happen too fast or the rate of the increase to be too high and you probably still want to cap it out at some point before it becomes an easily farmable joke.

I'll just leave this here for you to play around with:

Code: Select all

tanh(K^2(S+S(0.5*MF)))*0.0009+B

Where
K = # of kills
S = spread (how quick the drop rate increases)
MF = skill points in Magic Finder
B = base drop rate (1:10,000 or 0.0001

Personally, I'd choose the following values:

Code: Select all

tanh(K^2(0.00000003+0.00000003(0.5*MF)))*0.0009+0.0001

dropchance2.png

With 0 points in MF, you have a base drop rate of 1:10,000 (just like now) but it increases and by the time you've killed 3,991 the drop rate will be 1:2,000 and it reaches a cap of 1:1,000 by the time you get to 18,121 kills (far more than it should actually take to get the item). Actually, you'll be very close to the cap long before you get that far... 7,752 kills gives you about a 1:1,050 chance and even 6,993 kills gives about a 1:1,100 chance.

Throw in 20 points of MF and it only takes 1,204 kills to get to a 1:2,000 chance and 2,109 puts you at about 1:1,100. You cap out at 1:1,000 by the time you reach 5,464 kills.

Anywho, just a suggestion. I know there's been plenty of discussion on it and this is just something I threw together in a jiffy. I'm quite sure there are better formulas to use and hopefully this is enough to get someone who knows more math to say "oh yeah, we should just use ____ formula because it's awesome and works far better than that lame one you just cooked up."

https://www.desmos.com/calculator

= = = edit = = =

Eh, ignore the above post... I forgot about the even better system that I recommend: Vendors should sell all items including legendary and extraordinary items. Gold dropped from monsters would probably need a bit of balancing. Legendary items would still drop from monsters with the same drop rate as now but this way you could also just save and save and save enough gold by grinding anywhere you want to and you wouldn't be forced to grind the same 3 blasted rooms with a pitiful 11 monsters. Obviously, the cost of the items should be exorbitant as befitting their rarity and should even be so costly that few people would ever obtain them all. You should be forced to pick and choose carefully which ones you want and which ones you can do without until you've gathered a lot more gold.

[Oet]

fineraq,

Myself i think the drop rate is fine as it is, and it shouldn't increase by each kill. They should be hard to obtain, no matter what.

The NPC part on the other hand sounds quite cool. But as you said, there will have to be some changes to the gold you get etc. etc.

My only point in this rare spawn thing is that it would be fun. To check back in the cave/room and finally see that beast among the other monsters you have killed the past 500 times you visited, knowing you will get your precious item you have hunted for a long time. Checking you hp, saving the game 10 times, just in case, and then walk up to the mighty beast. Would be fun.

[Pyrizzle]

New day, new ideas...
I wanna talk about two things. Rare monsters and unbalanced skills.

Rare monsters
There is Legendary items, Extraordinary and rares. Why not monsters?
Let's say that we redo 1 spawn of "Wyrm apprentice"
That specific spawn has a 0,01% chance of spawning an "Undead Wyrm Master" instead of a Wyrm apprentice. The Undead Wyrm Master has significantly increased stats but will have a 100% drop chance of a Legendary item.




Unbalanced skills
Correct me if I'm wrong here, but aren't the skills a bit unbalanced? I am thinking about Weapon Accuracy, Hard Hit and Dodge.
Weapon Accuracy gives you 12% AC for each level.
Hard Hit hives you 2 AD each level.
Dodge gives you 9% BC each level.

Here's my point. If you want as much stats as possible, you will not choose Hard hit.
You get a skill point each 4 levels.
In 4 levels, by leveling up, you can get either 20% AC, 4 AD or 12% BC.

Weapon Accuracy will give you 60% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.
Hard Hit will give you 50% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.
Dodge will give you 75% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.

So, by other words, by never picking BC and instead leveling Dodge Skill, would max out the character faster?
(for the sake of making this as easy as possible, just imagine you have maxed out the other skills)

Both Topics have been brought up many times before.

Unbalanced Skills: Balancing leveling statistic bonuses (AD, HP, AC, BC) http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1512

Rare NPCs: http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3302

Use the search button before posting new ideas, a lot of the time they have been suggested before!

[Oet]

New day, new ideas...
I wanna talk about two things. Rare monsters and unbalanced skills.

Rare monsters
There is Legendary items, Extraordinary and rares. Why not monsters?
Let's say that we redo 1 spawn of "Wyrm apprentice"
That specific spawn has a 0,01% chance of spawning an "Undead Wyrm Master" instead of a Wyrm apprentice. The Undead Wyrm Master has significantly increased stats but will have a 100% drop chance of a Legendary item.




Unbalanced skills
Correct me if I'm wrong here, but aren't the skills a bit unbalanced? I am thinking about Weapon Accuracy, Hard Hit and Dodge.
Weapon Accuracy gives you 12% AC for each level.
Hard Hit hives you 2 AD each level.
Dodge gives you 9% BC each level.

Here's my point. If you want as much stats as possible, you will not choose Hard hit.
You get a skill point each 4 levels.
In 4 levels, by leveling up, you can get either 20% AC, 4 AD or 12% BC.

Weapon Accuracy will give you 60% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.
Hard Hit will give you 50% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.
Dodge will give you 75% of what you would have got by leveling that skill in 4 levels.

So, by other words, by never picking BC and instead leveling Dodge Skill, would max out the character faster?
(for the sake of making this as easy as possible, just imagine you have maxed out the other skills)

Both Topics have been brought up many times before.

Unbalanced Skills: Balancing leveling statistic bonuses (AD, HP, AC, BC) http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1512

Rare NPCs: http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3302

Use the search button before posting new ideas, a lot of the time they have been suggested before!

Hmm, I did search. For more then a minute... I guess I have to step up my game a bit when it comes to this. Sorry

[Beirlis]

Well, I'm still going to +1 the rare spawns. However, I probably wouldn't have the rare spawn always drop the loot. I think that if you want an 1:1000 chance of a spawn having your item, give the rare spawn a 1:100 chance of spawning and then a 1:10 chance of dropping it.

EDIT: In fact, I don't see spawnChance being used anywhere in the monsterlist*.json files. I propose changing that to "respawnRate" (a Range object of min and max ticks) and use something mechanism suggested from the "Respawns in areas that you aren't in" thread to manage respawns, but have the time decided at death of the original monster. Then change com.gpl.rpg.AndorsTrail.model.map.MonsterSpawnArea.monsterTypeIDs from an array of Strings to an array of something that contains both the chance and the monster type id, e.g.

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class SpawnTypes {
    String typeId;
    float chance;
};

So now when we spawn something from that spawn area, each monster can have a different chance of appearing. This however, would involve a change to the jsons.